New SWC app design


#41

But ok cool thankyou for the explanation.


#42

@Kyle93 @DaveUK I think we should get an invite, seeing as we are valued members of this forum. I’d like to meet this team of experts they have, who cock up my step conversions…


#43

I did get a invite funny enough. This was ages ago this public get together. Was maybe a 1.5 year ago… not entirely sure.


#44

@Kyle93 October 2019 :slight_smile:


#45

Thankyou deb. there we go @Seaside71 but I can verify it was a legit event lol. Based in London somewhere.


#46

Me to haha. I would of loved to go! :grinning:


#47

new design is good but could not see the steps converted to sweatcoins on the fly when walking and could not able to convert steps manually


#48

This is deliberate and eventually it will disssapear altogether as they want to make it as intransparent as possible. If we cant check the conversion rates we cant complain at how bad and inconsistent it is.


#49

Looking at the email I just read, it seems the new version will be completely replacing the old version. From the way it reads, it looks like the old version won’t even be accessible.
Until reading this I wasn’t too bother because there was still a choice. However, I have noticed that the new version doesn’t actually display steps including those collected by the Apple Watch. Although, it still converts the steps, it doesn’t show the data on the main counter. If you go on a hunt through the wallet, the figures will show but only up to the membership limit.
One of the primary reasons I have found the app so motivating is that the algorithm strips out the random activities that get added to steps. I know it won’t necessarily be the same for everyone but personally I find it more of a motivation to see the verified activity and see the effort I’ve put in rather than how bouncy my day is. Effectively the change removes the concept of ‘Sweatcoin Steps’ after the membership limit is reached and keeps the figures well hidden up to that point. Seems almost like a step backwards in some respects, hiding away and putting restrictions on what is likely the key feature that sets Sweatcoin a clear step above so many other apps, at least from an exercise perspective anyway.
There’s also the issue of absolutely everything appearing on the landing page. I am wondering how long it will be before a user downgrades by accident and can’t work out why they can’t convert up to the limit they thought they had. If I can manage to make numerous erroneous phone calls from a locked phone in my pocket, I’m sure accidentally switching memberships won’t take me long.
I apologise, it’s rare I have anything particularly negative contribute. I also understand that these are simply my personal views based on my own usage and experiences with the app. We each get something different from the app, I just know what has motivated me to push my exercise and activity harder. Mobiles have counted steps for years but it wasn’t until using an app that showed me the effort I was actually putting in rather than how my phone moves came along that it was really encouraged me to really kick in and progress.


#50

Many thanks for your valuable feedback, Phatt. I just deactivated the automatic update of the app i.e. my journey with updating this app to new versions is ending here.

@Ashton, @khmelev
I really don’t want to be offensive, but nearly every active member on this forum gave feedback that they want the detailled step conversion section back.

Looking at the fact that the reward system already got a huge change (anybody might give an assessment on his own about that) what is the Unique Selling Proposition of this app anymore if you also remove the step conversion mechanism? A pure counter for steps - for me this would be definitely not enough to keep this app, not to mention even paying for it!

I can only kindly ask again to re-think this upgrade!

Many thanks and best regards
Hans


#51

+1
+10000000000000000000


#52

First of all I’d like to say thank you to @Phatt.One and @Hansi2019 for speaking up! I really appreciate it.

We always envisioned Sweatcoin to be a reflection of one’s effort, but currently it doesn’t and it doesn’t matter whether we show anything on Today’s screen or not. We’ve already failed with that. That’s why @Phatt.One found verified steps as a proxy of his effort. But lets stop here for a minute and lets question what does effort really means? Effort is very complicated concept. It is relative, it is not bigger for those who walk the most, it is actually how much you were able to improve vs yourself in the past. Imagine a person who walks 500 steps a day on average, for him huge effort will be to start walking 2000 steps a day on average, but overtime, when it became a habit, his effort will approach zero. For someone who walks 100,000 steps a day on average, it will require quite a bit of effort to walk 120,000 steps a day, but for 100,000 steps a day, if it’s a habit, it won’t require any significant effort. Therefore effort might be similar for both of this persons, even though for one it was only 1500 steps improvement when for another it is 20,000 steps improvement. See, its not simple, but thats only one point, effort is a way more complicated. I personally value effort, and that why I never watch any ads in the app, because reward in my head diminish my effort. Also, that why I personally don’t really engage with current version of Daily Boost anymore, it doesn’t reflect my effort either, it just doubles what you’ve walked and its enough to enable it during any of your walks to just earn a little extra, you don’t need to put your effort in it. But we are preparing next version of the Boost pretty soon which I engage a lot and quite like personally, because it will require quite a bit of one’s effort.

To address your point @Hansi2019, steps verification mechanism will stay, this is the only thing that can confirm one’s effort which is very valuable to us.

Now, about this update, I can assure you that we hear everyone of you and we note all the complaints. And we will try to address them in future, but it might be solved in a very different way then you can currently imagine. We developed this app over the course of 5 years already and we’ve never had a time to stop and rethink what we’ve done and if we done it correctly. And from one side we have active members on the forum (who actually walk quite a lot) who express their opinion and frustrations and on the other side we have data from millions of other users, and their frustrations which they express through reviews and support channels, and which tells us completely different story. And I get that you guys understood our verification model and how it works pretty well and want to see exact numbers, but other people didn’t. And also, let me shed a bit of light on how much actually people walk. On average, typical UK user walks around 3-4k steps, when in US this number is lower, closer to 2-3k steps a day. For them its pretty damn hard to explain why those 500 steps didn’t convert (most probably it will convert a bit later) and why it doesn’t work at all (remember that we submit approx every 2000 steps, it is complicated to make it realtime and it will skyrocket our cost). For them it is more beneficial to think of steps like of “steps” that they see in HealthKit/GoogleFit and do not overcomplicate things. By the end of the day, if you don’t want to cheat the model (and most users actually don’t), your today’s steps is what matters to you, not your verified steps. People are so busy with their life that all they want is to see some appreciation of how much steps they did on their high days, and not to think why is there a discrepancy between steps they see in the app, steps they see in HK and verified steps, and why some of their steps are not verified (:exploding_head: I don’t cheat!). Our model strips on average very small amount of daily steps, for most of the users conversion is close to 99%. Its just not worth it to focus on verified steps anymore, it works pretty decent already.

And finally, Sweatcoin over the course of 2021 is going to change drastically, we will not be able to satisfy everyone of you, its just impossible. And if you’re not prepared or open for a change, you will most probably be disappointed. But, our mission has always been and will always be to make world more active and healthier and the value of effort is in our core. And to illustrate you this point, if we make average American to walk 500 steps more on average we will achieve our mission. But we won’t achieve it if we only make 100k users more active, we have to do it for 100 millions.


#53

Dear Egor,

many thanks for your comprehensive and enlightening feedback which I really appreciate like in former conversations.

I was not aware that (1) the steps of SWC users are significantly below 5k on average and (2) that therefore the wast majority is (understandably) not that interested in the conversion mechanism that much.

Taking this into account and even if I don’t want to call myself that name, a lot of feedback in this forum comes from “sweatcoin top performers” which are very interested in this feature. This is surely also borne by the fact that these highly active users are batteling for every sweatcoin in order to prevail in auctions - which honestly is a quite prominent feature of this app, thats why I can understand this.

I was also very sad that the conversion feature is not shown in the upgrade anymore since I am also optimizing my coin income in order to win auctions some day. Therefore the conversion section was very motivating for me since it showed me how much more steps I had to go until I get the next crediting for 2k steps. This was indeed motivating e.g. in the course of a challenge in order to get as many maximized (50) sweatcoin days as possible (to date I was able to make that strike last since October 30th :wink: As a tweek the conversion mechanism helped me to motivate and fine tune since I learned, that after I reached my daily limit of 50 SWC I could take approximately 900 steps into the next day without clearance of not yet converted step balance - this reduced my next days “workload” by 2 SWC, e.g. on busy days with less time for walking :wink:

You see that these are more or less “happy problems” from heavy users, but it would be great of course if it would be possible to also take their needs into account. E.g. if this data is not interesting to 99% of users why not keep this section and put it more in the background like “advanced features” where it doesn’t bother the average user but is still accessible for us “freaks” :wink:

Best regards from a power-Sweatcoiner
Hans


#54

@Phatt.One & @Hansi2019 have both articulated the challenges of losing this feature perfectly - I’d also really like to keep this feature but have nothing to add on top of their comments.:blush:


#55

I’m not even a super Sweatcoin achiever – my busy life and office work usually only let me take 5k steps a day, but gosh, I’m already disappointed just by reading this.

I get that the majority of users might not care about conversion rate (even though I feel this is weird because if they care about steps, wouldn’t they just download a step counter app or see it on their phones? But anyway, I know you got more research into that than I do), but you can absolutely please everyone by just giving the two options on the app: seeing the total steps while also showing how many of those steps were really converted and the commission rate… anyway, just my thoughts.


#56

Ok, now I got it to some point.

The button „force to conversion“ caused issues since from own users experience the conversion rate was lower if you pushed it before reaching 2,000 steps.

Yes that’s understandable.

Maybe a compromise could be to simply remove that manual conversion button but keep the other data which is motivating a lot in order to strive for the next 2,000 steps and crediting :slight_smile:


#57

One last remark. Even though that I use a new iPhone I still need this conversion section in order to get SWC crediting anyway.

For some reason I never get automated conversion. I always have to go to the conversion section from time to time (>2,000 steps), wait about 10 seconds until conversion kicks on.

I would not be able to do this in the new layout and would probably get no SWC at all.


#58

I don’t like the new design. I liked being able to revert to the old version. With the last update the ability to do this is no longer available. Please bring that back.


#59

[email protected]

Hi Egor,

a rather technical question on the new design which now can’t be reverted anymore.

Since we can’t force manual steps anymore is there a „clean cut mechanism“ converting the remaining steps at the end of every day? Otherwise it is possible that you loose up to 2,000 steps if you did not make it to the conversion limit at the end of the day.

Best regards Hans


#60

Unfortunately went on to update my apps and Sweatcoin was on the list… and now I’m stuck with the horrible new design with no option to revert to the previous!!! A lot of updates and NONE of the suggestions and complaints here were considered. This is so frustrating. Thinking about stop giving a shit about this app since I’m not really even close to a lot of coins.